How People Create: Heather Cocks and Jessica Morgan

Or, How Writing a Brilliant Blog Can Turn Into Writing Best-Selling Books

Have you ever read someone’s writing and then felt like you knew them personally? Like, ‘Oh these are my friends Heather and Jessica now, even though I’ve never met them and they have no idea who I am and I’m just some rando who reads their blog.’

Here’s another question for you: How many blogs that were founded in 2004 are STILL AROUND? AND GOOD?

I have been reading Go Fug Yourself since the beginning. I came for the photos of celebrities wearing crazy fashion, I stayed for the writing and I’m not the only one. The site still attracts millions of monthly page views!

The success of the blog led to them writing for other publications such as New York magazine and its various online components, Cosmopolitan, Rolling Stone, and InTouch. They became known for “covering the good, the bad, and the fugly of celebrity fashion — always unflinching, but never mean.”

You know you’ve reached peak internet when Us Weekly names you among the Top 25 Most Stylish New Yorkers and you live in Los Angeles, which happened to them in 2008.

(Most recently, for those of you interested in delightful internet writing but less concerned with celebrity fashion, they also now have a substack Drinks With Broads that I HIGHLY recommend, which covers all sorts of fascinating topics in pop culture.)

Now, with all that out of the way, today’s interview isn’t even about their work on the interwebs.

It’s actually about how they also happen to be the best-selling authors of four novels: THE ROYAL WE , which was lauded by People, The New York Times’ Janet Maslin, and Entertainment Weekly, among others, it’s sequel THE HEIR AFFAIR, and two young adult books SPOILED and it’s sequel MESSY.

Long story short: They are awesome. I’m a huge fan. Read on to learn how they do what they do so well.

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Photo credit: Moksha Bruno

When did each of you start exploring writing as a possible career and what eventually brought the two of you together as collaborators?

JESSICA: We were actually both working as writers when it happened! We met because we were working as recappers at the late, great TV recap site Mighty Big TV, later Television Without Pity, and started our celebrity fashion blog Go Fug Yourself together on a whim.

I have been reading this blog for a VERY LONG TIME.

We were also working in reality tv as story producers at the time, so lots of writing was happening. I have an English degree and worked as a writer in some capacity or another since I graduated back in the dark ages.

HEATHER: Same. I studied to be a journalist in college, and worked as a tech reporter at the daily newspaper in Austin for a year and a half after I graduated -- at which point I realized I loved writing but hated reporting and digging and the more intrusive sides of the job. Which are necessary, but some people are better wired to do it than others! So when I got a job offer to switch into reality TV, I grabbed it. That taught me a lot about storytelling and structure. And also how to work collaboratively, which Jess also was doing in her own reality TV jobs, so when it came time to work together on joint-byline projects, we carried all of that experience in with us.

How did your first co-written novel SPOILED come about?  What was the inspiration and driving factor in deciding to write it?

JESSICA: To be frank, we were told that some publishers would be interested in reading a YA book from us, on the strength of the blog's popularity at the time, and we thought it would be ridiculous to pass up the opportunity. The book itself -- which is about a young woman who finds out that the dad she thought was dead is actually the most famous movie star in the world -- sort of naturally grew out of our shared interest in the way people seek out celebrity, and the way others deal with having it thrust upon them.

HEATHER: We didn't think of this until it was pointed out to us, but Go Fug Yourself really is one big massive writing sample, easily accessed. It was somewhat less of a risk to get into the fiction business with us because a lot of the editors already knew we could play around with dialogue and what our voice might sound like.

What was the process like writing the book together?  Was it a natural extension of the writing you had been doing previously or did you have to come up with a new approach?

JESSICA: It was very natural! Heather and I at the time had been co-writing pieces for New York Magazine, so we were really used to collaborating. Obviously, for a book, we needed to figure out how to LITERALLY write it, like logistically -- but melding our voices was not a new challenge at that point.

Having written several successful novels at this point, could you walk us through the general process you go through from getting inspired to completing a novel?  (i.e. brainstorming, outlining, notecards, background, research, multiple drafts, etc)

JESSICA: Sure! Basically, that is exactly how it goes. I feel like I always say this but it's not that complicated to write a novel. It's pretty simple. (That doesn't mean it's EASY. It is not, it is hard work!) Basically, once we have an idea -- which is quite hard sometimes! -- we brainstorm together, then write a really detailed outline together. If we need research, it usually is happening concurrently to this, as well as to some of the writing. We had to do a lot of research for The Royal We, for example. We don't really do note cards unless the plot issues have gotten really grim. (I did use notecards a lot when I worked in TV but they are kind of last resort for novels for me.) Once the outline is set, we get to work writing it. Basically, we trade the draft back and forth, each editing the other's chunk before writing the next one. Once it's in good shape, it's off to the editor, or our agent, and we wait for notes. There's a couple of rounds of notes and editing -- I actually love editing -- and then into copyedits and then boom! You are done. We don't use beta readers or anything, simply because we are each other's beta readers, but sometimes we do pull someone else in to read the draft. My friend Eliza, who is British, read a draft of The Royal We to make sure our British characters sounded right, for example. 

Was there anything different in your process when switching from YA to the more adult THE ROYAL WE? (Team Freddie, over here, btw.)

JESSICA: Yes, for our YA novels, we could work off the outline simultaneously, each person working on a different chapter. But for The Royal We, it was a much dense and more complicated story, so we really couldn't do that anymore.  

HEATHER: We weren't ever really given edicts about "Here's what you can do and say in a YA novel, as opposed to an adult novel," though I do know of people anecdotally who've had to work within some guardrails for younger books, like middle grade. In terms of content we probably felt a little looser with the swearing and the intimacies for The Royal We, maybe? We just trusted that our editors would let us know if we went haywire in either direction, and it turned out fine. I will say that for SPOILED and MESSY, our YA novels, we did get notes about making a couple pop culture references that were too old for the actual current crop of young adults. Apparently, jokes about Kevin Costner's non-accent in Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves DO in fact feel confusing to Kids Today. Don't let history forget!! Make sure we pass that one down to the grandkids, everyone. 

When it comes to inspiration for a new story, do you wait until lightning strikes?  Or do you dive into things that excite you?  Or do you immerse yourself in a genre you want to focus on?  Or anything else?  (This is me trying to ask a better version of the question “Where do your ideas come from?”)

JESSICA: We wait for lightning to strike, I guess, but it doesn't very often -- which is why we haven't had a book out since 2020! It is VERY hard for us to come up with ideas that feel like they can sustain a complete novel. We actually need to improve the way we generate ideas because at the moment, it is a pokey process. There are some people who are total idea factories and I'm so jealous of that skill, it is a real gift.

How do you both address revisions or notes, either from an editor or early readers?  Especially if it’s something that doesn’t quite resonate with you?

JESSICA: We don't use early readers unless we have a really specific reason for it. I know they work so well for other writers but it's just not part of our process. I sort of don't want too many voices in my head. 

HEATHER: I also think that writing as a duo, we are each other's early readers, in a way. We're very rarely reading the entire book at the same time -- meaning, if Jessica just finished a chunk and sends it back to me, it's been a few weeks since I've seen it and I have fresher eyes. So far that's served us pretty well and we haven't needed to seek out other input. 

JESSICA: In terms of something not resonating, something we learned when we worked in TV -- which is really note-heavy and I think trained both of us to take notes pretty much in stride -- is that if you're getting a note, SOMETHING is wrong. It might not be what your editor is suggesting, but there is definitely something there that they're stumbling on, and you can usually figure it out. You need to address the SPIRIT of the note, not the letter. Now, we've also been fortunate -- I certainly know people who've gotten totally wild notes that they disagreed with, correctly. In that case, I think you just need to advocate for your own work. You are the final word, after all. No pun intended.

How do you navigate disagreements among yourselves when you each have a different idea of how something should go?

JESSICA: We are honestly very boring -- we just talk it through. We are not argumentative partners at all. I think we're both pretty good -- sometimes perhaps too good! - at hearing the other person's take. You have to let go of some of your ego when you're writing with another person.

HEATHER: Everyone's goal is the same: to print a book we're proud of, and that we're excited to have our names on, and NOBODY in the world cares which of us wrote what word or came up with which plot point. Ergo, we don't care either. Just make it good. So we'll follow the various ideas through aloud, and see if we like or believe where they end up. Usually the answer becomes pretty apparent. But neither of us has ever had a "right" idea that is only ours -- maybe one of us had the correct direction, but then the other one adds to it or enriches it, and then back and forth, so the whole thing really does end up being a product of us both.

How have you approached writing sequels (THE HEIR AFFAIR and MESSY)?  Do you have an idea in the back of your mind when writing the first book, or do you come up with the story later?

JESSICA: Both of our sequels, we came up with later. THE ROYAL WE was not designed to have a sequel at all.

HEATHER: SPOILED, we knew was part of a two-book deal, and we assumed it would involve a sequel so we had a couple ideas in mind for it. Brooke Berlin's mother Kelly was going to show up at the end of the first book and be a launching point for the second. But, our editors cut it because they'd decided they didn't want a direct sequel. Anthologized series were becoming popular -- the idea of taking a character from the first book and writing the second one about THEM instead. So they pitched that to us, and we agreed that would be more fun.

Do you feel pressure with a sequel to deliver what the first book’s fans might want?  Not like Kathy Bates in MISERY is going to come after you or anything, but… do you think about what the expectations might be?

JESSICA: YES. This is the hardest thing, in my opinion, about ANY second book -- but especially a sequel to something that was popular. It is VERY hard for me to place this out of my mind, but you really have to try to write to the story and not to people's expectations. If it's good enough, hopefully people will enjoy it no matter what they expected it to be.

Are there things you do when you want to write but you’re feeling stuck or uninspired?  (i.e. go to the movies, take a walk, be in nature, etc)

JESSICA: This is a classic answer but for me this is true: Take a shower. 

HEATHER: Yes, or a drive, or just a walk. Fortnite. Whatever. SOMETHING else.

How do you feel about working with deadlines?  Do they help push you or add anxiety to the mix?

JESSICA: Well, given how late I gave you this back, CLEARLY I need deadlines! I don't have a ton of anxiety about deadlines in general -- I was always a good self-starter in school, I truly think it's just genetic? -- but at the same time, I think there is something to be said for working on something that no one expects or even knows is happening. Having said that, we have been late on some book deadlines and MISSING a deadline gives me big anxiety. 

HEATHER: I love and need a deadline. And like a lot of people, I have honed the skill of being able to hit the gas when it's crunch time. A deadline is really just structure, and I find structure super helpful in any capacity. It's also why we write with outlines. When you know when something is ending, you can work backward and figure out how much time you need to get there, so that there aren't any nasty surprises. I'm trying to teach my kids how to do this. They're teenagers, so as you can imagine, they're not that receptive to my organizational strategies. Hah.

Describe your last writing session (day of week, time of day, how long, where, what did you do before, did you listen to music, etc.)

JESSICA: We're not working on a book at the moment, but we write full time as our dayjob so it was basically office hours today! We have a lot on our plates and generally always have, so I've trained myself to just kinda get it done when it needs to get done.

HEATHER: I have a lot of what I call one-eye shows -- things I can put on the TV while I work for when I need a distraction or a brain break. I don't have to pay close attention, but when something juicy happens, I can look up and gasp, and stuff. I find sports great for this, too, so I watch a lot of those. The soundtrack to my workday is usually TV. I usually begin with our longer-lead projects, like anything for our Substack newsletter, and then later in the day when the event photos are rolling in, I'll plug into what we're running on Go Fug Yourself the next day. Because of that, our workdays tend to be pretty long -- sometimes pics don't come in until late, even on the West Coast -- but there are plenty of gaps in between where we can work out, or go to the doctor, or watch a two-eye show.

Are there any tips or methods you both have learned as a writer over the years that you think could be useful to others? (i.e. slow down, vomit draft, writing out of order, etc)

JESSICA: Everyone has different stuff that works for them. I am a very linear writer and I don't have anything very fancy that I do -- I honestly just sit down and write in order from an outline. It's really pretty workman-like.  I know this is boring! I am a fairly pragmatic person and I think that applies to my creative process too. I would say that the one thing that has really helped me is something Heather and I read at Lainey Gossip, a million years ago: She wrote that Blair Waldorf is a more successful and interesting character than Serena is because you ALWAYS know what Blair wants, and you never really know what Serena does. I think we've carried that into everything. You have to know what your characters want. I think about that a lot.

HEATHER: Mine is also, just write! I don't always obey this rule, because I want to sit down and have it flow perfectly right away, but honestly just getting SOMETHING on the page is the best strategy because then your brain will connect to it and edit it and tweak it and you'll start to roll. But I DO think an outline is valuable. Don't flog yourself about sticking to it like glue -- yes, the outline has plot in it, but where it's REALLY important is for the EMOTIONAL beats your characters need to hit. What are they feeling, and why, and where does THAT take them? Our outlines for The Royal We and The Heir Affair were REALLY long, and often wrong, but having done that basic framework made it really easy to adapt on the fly and we did that a LOT.

Anything else about your process that you’d like to add?  (i.e. Dreams?  Manual typewriter? Hot tub?)

JESSICA: Well, I'd like to FIND OUT how a hot tub improves my process!!! Let me just say that and hope we manifest it.